Does Islam command the killing of disbelieving civilians and captives? A debate that took place between me and an Islamophobe.

Further Topic Research:

Where was the promised Holy Spirit in the disciples' apostatizing of each other??

The Romans had to fake fake his crucifixion due to Passover issues: [1]

One of my all time best Noble Verses in the Holy Quran:

"O ye who believe! stand out firmly for God, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear God. For God is well-acquainted with all that ye do. (The Noble Quran, 5:8)"

9/11: The biggest lie in history!

Watch these videos from White-Americans (not Arab- Muslims) proving that the Pentagon bombing was done by a Global Hawk drone! No bodies and no airplane-debris were found! Also, no noise was either recorded or detected by any ordinary person!

Please visit: Does Islam command the killing of disbelieving civilians and captives? A text-debate that took place between me and an Islamophobe on David Wood's blog.

The following debate thoroughly demonstrates that ISIS is not Islamic, and that it was made by the zionists to pave the way for the "Another 9/11":

IS ISIS ISLAMIC?
Osama Abdallah vs David Wood Debate
Saturday 12/06/2014

The Debate PowerPoints contain the written material for my presentation and rebuttals.

Also visit this website's Youtube Channel at: www.youtube.com/QuranSearchCom.

Also, this is a 38-minute video rebuttal that refutes David Wood's video, which he called "The Three Stages of Jihad" or "3-Stage Jihad". I also uploaded the video-rebuttal to my Youtube Channel:

(Click on image to play video)

Allah Almighty sent a Prophet and a Messenger to the Arabs because they were fresh and had no previous Prophets before. They also had no corrupt scriptures like the Jews and Christians had. The pagan Arabs were ready for a new Prophet and a new Divine Religion. This is why Prophet Muhammad was sent. He was sent:

1- To move the Arabs and mankind from the worship of idols to the worship of the True One Living and Sovereign GOD Almighty of the Universe, and to associate no partners with Him.

2- To restore the original Faith, which is Islam, after the Jews and Christians had corrupted it and invented their own lies and man-made conjectures and alterations of scriptures.

Furthermore, after Islam prevailed and ruled over the disbelievers, Allah Almighty Commanded the Muslims to:

1- Be Just to all of the disbelievers and all people in general.
2- Show Mercy and Forgiveness to all disbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).
3- Show the Love of Allah Almighty to all disbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).

I've provided ample Noble Verses from the Glorious Quran that proved this. And these Noble Verses came AFTER Islam became victorious over the disbelievers, not before. So after the hostile times ended, Allah Almighty Commanded the Muslims to go back to the roots of Islam, which is Justice, Mercy, Kindness, Forgiveness and to show the Love of Allah Almighty to all:

On Justice:

"O ye who believe! stand out firmly for God, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear God (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). For God is well-acquainted with all that ye do. (The Noble Quran, 5:8)"

"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (The Noble
Quran, 60:8)"

".....Help ye one another in righteousness and piety, but help ye not one another in sin and rancour: fear God: for God is strict in punishment. (The Noble Quran, 5:2)"

"God doth command you to render back your Trusts to those to whom they are due; And when ye judge between man and man, that ye judge with justice: Verily how excellent is the teaching which He giveth you! For God is He Who heareth and seeth all things. (The Noble Quran, 4:58)"

"O ye who believe! stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to God, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for God can best protect both..... (The Noble Quran, 4:135)"

On Islam being "Jew Hating" (David Wood made this claim):

"Of the people of Moses there is a section who guide and do justice in the light of truth. (The Noble Quran, 7:159)"

"It was We who revealed the law (to Moses): therein was guidance and light. By its standard have been judged the Jews, by the prophets who bowed (as in Islam) to God's will, by the rabbis and the doctors of law: for to them was entrusted the protection of God's book, and they were witnesses thereto: therefore fear not men, but fear me, and sell not my signs for a miserable price. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what God hath revealed, they are (no better than) Unbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). (The Noble Quran, 5:44)"

"Those who believe (in the Quran), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve. (The Noble Quran, 2:62)"

On Mercy and Forgiveness:

Let's see Islam's Golden Rule and the Noble Verses that deal with Forgiving and Forgetting the faults of others:

"Those who spend (freely), whether in prosperity, or in adversity; who restrain anger, and pardon (all) men;- for God loves those who do good;- (The Noble Quran, 3:134)"

"Hold to forgiveness; command what is right; But turn away from the ignorant. (The Noble Quran, 7:199)"

"We created not the heavens, the earth, and all between them, but for just ends. And the Hour is surely coming (when this will be manifest). So overlook (any human faults) with gracious forgiveness. (The Noble Quran, 15:85)"

"But because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them, and made their hearts grow hard; they change the words from their (right) places and forget a good part of the message that was sent them, nor wilt thou cease to find them- barring a few - ever bent on (new) deceits: but forgive them, and overlook (their misdeeds): for God loveth those who are kind. (The Noble Quran, 5:13)"

"Quite a number of the People of the Book wish they could Turn you (people) back to infidelity after ye have believed, from selfish envy, after the Truth hath become Manifest unto them: But forgive and overlook, Till God accomplish His purpose; for God Hath power over all things. (The Noble Quran, 2:109)"

"Let not those among you who are endued with grace and amplitude of means resolve by oath against helping their kinsmen, those in want, and those who have left their homes in God's cause: let them forgive and overlook, do you not wish that God should forgive you? For God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. (The Noble Quran, 24:22)"

"Tell those who believe, to forgive those who do not look forward to the Days of God: It is for Him to recompense (for good or ill) each People according to what they have earned. (The Noble Quran, 45:14)"

The Love of Allah Almighty:

"They perform (their) vows, and they fear a Day whose evil flies far and wide. And they feed, for the love of God, the indigent, the orphan, and the captive,- (Saying),"We feed you for the sake of God alone: no reward do we desire from you, nor thanks. "We only fear a Day of distressful Wrath from the side of our Lord." (The Noble Quran, 76:7-10)"

"But he hath made no haste on the path that is steep. And what will explain to thee the path that is steep?- (It is:) freeing the bondman; Or the giving of food in a day of privation To the orphan with claims of relationship, Or to the indigent (down) in the dust. Then will he be of those who believe, and enjoin patience, (constancy, and self-restraint), and enjoin deeds of kindness and compassion. (The Noble Quran, 90:11-17)"

"It is not righteousness that ye turn your faces Towards east or West; but it is righteousness- to believe in God and the Last Day, and the Angels, and the Book, and the Messengers; to spend of your substance, out of love for Him, for your kin, for orphans, for the needy, for the wayfarer, for those who ask, and for the ransom of slaves; to be steadfast in prayer, and practice regular charity; to fulfil the contracts which ye have made; and to be firm and patient, in pain (or suffering) and a dversity, and throughout all periods of panic. Such are the people of truth, the God-fearing. (The Noble Quran, 2:177)"

"They ask thee what they should spend (In charity). Say: Whatever ye spend that is good, is for parents and kindred and orphans and those in want and for wayfarers. And whatever ye do that is good, -God knoweth it well. (The Noble Quran, 2:215)"

"And render to the kindred their due rights, as (also) to those in want, and to the wayfarer: But squander not (your wealth) in the manner of aspendthrift. (The Noble Quran, 17:26)"

On Wife Beating in Islam:

The Glorious Quran commands the beating of the NASHIZ (loose, flirty, unjustly defiant) wife after the 2nd warning was given to her. After that, they must sit with elderlies from her side and his to decide on whether the marriage should continue or not. By the way, the Arabic word DARABA also means to "leave". It doesn't just mean to "beat", and I've provided several Noble Verses where the word DARABA was used for leaving and traveling abroad from the Glorious Quran.

For normal women who fear Allah Almighty and aren't loose or flirty or unjustly defiant, Allah Almighty and Prophet Muhammad commanded the husbands to:

1- Never beat their wives.
2- Never mistreat or bully their wives.
3- Always speak kind words to their wives.
4- To provide for their wives peace, love and harmony.

This is a very long topic to discuss here. I've provided ample Noble Verses and Hadiths in the following link: https://www.answering-christianity.com/beating.htm. I've also proven from David Wood's Bible that wife-beating is allowed to evil wives.

For all of the points that I discussed earlier, there are many more Noble Verses that I could provide for all of the points that I discussed above. The Noble Verses that I displayed in this video were only a select few that I chose.

Does Islam command the killing of disbelieving civilians and captives? A debate that took place between me and an Islamophobe:

The following is a text debate that took place between me and an Islamophobe on David Wood's blog. In this debate, you'll see the common ridiculous and desperate lies that the Islamophobes hang on for dear life, because they have nothing else to present against Islam. Below you'll clearly see what exactly I mean, and you be the judge.

I am "Osama Abdallah", and the Islamophobe is "Search4Truth".

Osama Abdallah said...

Thank you America for the generous hospital! America doesn't have to be the enemy of the Muslims! All America has to do is wake up, and put the feces that is controlling it and stinking it where they belong, and then, and ONLY THEN, the American people will easily find themselves at peace with everyone. I am going to quote something out of the Bible, and I think you'll know who I am talking about:

Isaiah 59
Contemporary English Version (CEV)

Social Injustice Is Condemned
59 The Lord hasn't lost
his powerful strength;
he can still hear
and answer prayers.
2 Your sins are the roadblock
between you and your God.
That's why he doesn't answer
your prayers
or let you see his face.

3 Your talk is filled with lies
and plans for violence;
every finger on your hands
is covered with blood.
4 You falsely accuse others
and tell lies in court;
sin and trouble are the names
of your children.
5 You eat the deadly eggs
of poisonous snakes,
and more snakes crawl out
from the eggs left to hatch.
You weave spider webs,
6 but you can't make clothes
with those webs
or hide behind them.

You're sinful and brutal.
7 You hurry off to do wrong
or murder innocent victims.
All you think about is sin;
you leave ruin and destruction
wherever you go.
8 YOU DO NOT KNOW HOW TO LIVE IN PEACE
or to be fair with others (See also Isaiah 1:9-17: Yahweh called Israel Sodom, because it spreads evil and is unjust).
The roads you make are crooked;
your followers cannot find peace.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

: And if your answer is something like this:

Osama, do you honestly believe that we, the Americans, can have peace with the Talibans?

RESPONSE:

The talibans do not represent the Muslims. Countries like the UAE (with its Dubai and Abu Dhabi), and the mentality that they live in represent the overwhelming majority of the Muslims.

1- Libya today chose a liberal party, and not an Islamic conservative one to rule it.

2- Egypt's Mursi chose his vice president to be a COPTIC WOMAN; A Christian woman.

So please, look at these Muslims. Not the Talibans who hardly even represent themselves, and they don't even represent 1% of the Muslims out there. And by the way, we also have great countries like Malaysia and others that are modern and very very peaceful with everyone.

Besides, I think the sad events that happened lately from Norway and the Colorado massacures, I think you'll have a far far greater chance getting killed by someone who looks a European White than one who looks Middle Eastern. It's saddens me to admit that I felt a little relief when the Colorado massacure happened because it happened by a white guy. It kind of lifted the prejudice against us, Muslims, a little. And as a Muslim, I am commanded by Allah Almighty to be Just and Fair and Friendly with everyone:

"Allah forbids you not, With regard to those who Fight you not for (your) Faith Nor drive you out Of your homes, From dealing kindly and justly With them: For Allah loveth Those who are just. (The Noble Quran, 60:8)"

There are many Noble Verses like this. These Noble Verses came down to fix the MUSLIM BULLIES. Allah Almighty forbade them from bullying peaceful disbelievers and to be unjust and unfriendly with them.

This is my Islam that I stand firmly by.

I hope this helps.

Regards,
Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

Search 4 Truth said...

Osama

You are practicing Islam incorrectly. Read what your scholars say. And go back to the other postings and see my clear rebuttals to your nonsense on the second page. Others are waiting as well. Now are you a better scholar than the two Jalalayns?

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ لاَّ يَنْهَاكُمُ ٱللَّهُ عَنِ ٱلَّذِينَ لَمْ يُقَاتِلُوكُمْ فِي ٱلدِّينِ وَلَمْ يُخْرِجُوكُمْ مِّن دِيَارِكُمْ أَن تَبَرُّوهُمْ وَتُقْسِطُوۤاْ إِلَيْهِمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ يُحِبُّ ٱلْمُقْسِطِينَ }

God does not forbid you in regard to those who did not wage war against you, from among the disbelievers, on account of religion and did not expel you from your homes, that you should treat them kindly (an tabarrūhum is an inclusive substitution for alladhīna, ‘those who') and deal with them justly: this was [revealed] before the command to struggle against them. Assuredly God loves the just.

Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan

So as you can see this ayat was abrogated by the later ones that command Muslims to fight, subjugate or slaughter all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus).

You live a lie and you spew lies!

July 28, 2012 11:29 AM

Osama Abdallah said...

"So as you can see this ayat was abrogated by the later ones that command Muslims to fight, subjugate or slaughter all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus).

You live a lie and you spew lies!"

RESPONSE:

First of all, no two Muslim "scholars" agree on the amount of the Noble Verses that were "abrogated" (notice the double quotes here), nor on what Noble Verses supposedly abrogated what Noble Verses. This is a fact, and I challenge you to dispute it.

Allah Almighty's Holy Words in the Holy Quran are 100% applicable for all times and all places. The lie of abrogation that was born from ignorance has no place in Islam. It was the previous Laws that the Holy Quran's Laws came to abrogate. Muslims don't have to follow the Jewish Law.

Also, the so-called "abrogation" is no more than applying certain Noble Verses to certain situations. So in the times of war, we have Laws of War (good treatment of captives is part of them). And in the times of peace, we have Laws for Peace. In either way, those who do not wage wars on us and do choose to remain at peace with us must get the Justice and Kindness from us:

"Allah forbids you not, With regard to those who Fight you not for (your) Faith Nor drive you out Of your homes, From dealing kindly and justly With them: For Allah loveth Those who are just. (The Noble Quran, 60:8)"

And even in your writings above, no where does it say that Noble Verse 60:8 doesn't apply today.

I know you're filled with hate towards Islam. You're too blinded with hate against GOD Almighty. Islam came to fix your crooked and corrupt man-made faith and to set you straight. I am very very certain that deep inside your heart you know that your faith is not geniune. You can't! You couldn't! It's just far too corrupted with man's alterations and fabrications. So what you're left with is envy and hate towards Islam.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

Osama Abdallah said...

"So as you can see this ayat was abrogated by the later ones that command Muslims to fight, subjugate or slaughter all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus)."

RESPONSE:

I missed this nonsense of yours in my previous reply. Show me where the Holy Quran Commands the slaughter of "all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus)." If you're not a liar, then produce your proof.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama.

Denial is not a rebuttal. The Jalalayn tafsir clearly sight that 60:8 was abrogated after the command to fight against the non believers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). So are you saying that Mhutta is still applicable? it is you who is filled with hate. Yes I hate evil Ideologies like Islam.

Just because you want to reinvent Islam and mold it into what you wish it were, or you want to lie to the kafre in order to woo us into a position of complacency until you can impose your evil system of fascism, and oppression on us, does not mean that it was not abrogated. Your greatest scholars concur with me, and disagree with you.

So we are all suppose to take your word that it wasnt abrogated, and dismiss Jalalayn? LOL! And then when you are in a position of power you can say, well, Jalalayn was correct. Is that how it works?

We see through your evil games Osama. Your the one who is commanded to hate, persecute, extort and slaughter us. Now the other way around.

(9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

It seems your pervert hypocrite monster of a false Prophet agreed with me as well.

Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah

Bukhari (8:387) - Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah'. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally."

Muslim (1:30) - "The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah."

Was Mohamed mistaken as well as Jalalayn? LOL! Your pathetic!; "@ Osama.

Denial is not a rebuttal. The Jalalayn tafsir clearly sight that 60:8 was abrogated after the command to fight against the non believers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). So are you saying that Mhutta is still applicable? it is you who is filled with hate. Yes I hate evil Ideologies like Islam."

Again, when it comes to integrity and honesty, the christians usually take the back seat. As I clearly and indisputably showed above, nothing EVEN IN YOUR QUOTE ABOVE suggested abrogation. So you're the desperate deceiver here, not me.

"Just because you want to reinvent Islam and mold it into what you wish it were, or you want to lie to the kafre in order to woo us into a position of complacency until you can impose your evil system of fascism, and oppression on us, does not mean that it was not abrogated. Your greatest scholars concur with me, and disagree with you."

I do not want to reinvent Islam. Islam is solid and unchanged. It is your crooked religion of conjecture (as the Holy Quran calls it) that had been reinvented many many times and is still being reinvented. You don't even know what to believe anymore.

"So we are all suppose to take your word that it wasnt abrogated, and dismiss Jalalayn? LOL! And then when you are in a position of power you can say, well, Jalalayn was correct. Is that how it works?"

Again, nothing even in the quote that you provided above suggests abrogation. It is you who doesn't even know what the concept is. Also, many Islamic Scholars today clearly refute abrogation and have proven that it is an abrogation of the previous Jewish Law. But be as it may, even if we accept that there is actual abrogation in the Holy Quran to the Holy Quran, it is clear that it is ******Laws that were put to solve specific situation. So for war, there are Laws for War. And for peace, there are Laws for Peace, and so on.

"We see through your evil games Osama. Your the one who is commanded to hate, persecute, extort and slaughter us. Now the other way around.

(9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

It seems your pervert hypocrite monster of a false Prophet agreed with me as well."

I want everyone to see how this clown here is, again, the depserate liar. He earlier said that ************Islam commands the killed OF ALL DISBELIEVERS ALL THE TIME! His statement is in this thread. My challenge to him wasn't show me where the Holy Quran Commands the Muslims to fight for the Cause of Allah Almighty and for spreading His Divine Truth, Islam. My challenge to this clown was show me where the Holy Quran commands THE KILLING OF ALL DISBELIEVERS ALL THE TIME, as this clown claimed. He couldn't answer.

(continued)

Osama Abdallah said...

"Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah

Bukhari (8:387) - Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah'. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally."

Muslim (1:30) - "The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah."

Was Mohamed mistaken as well as Jalalayn? LOL! Your pathetic!"

Again, this clown failed to show us where the Holy Quran Commands the killing of ALL DISBELIEVERS ALL THE TIME. Not only he miserably failed to produce his proof, but he also concealed the following Noble Verses that further expose him to be a liar:

[002:190] Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors.

[002:191] *******And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

[002:192] But if they cease, God is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

[002:193] And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God; but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

So fight the hostile infidels until you either win the battle, or they surrender, or you lose the battle. And if they surrender, then don't fight them, nor mistreat them:

********************
[076:008] And they feed, for the love of God, the indigent, the orphan, and the captive,-
***********************

So again, if you are not indeed a desperate liar here, then I renew my challenge to you:

Show me where the Holy Quran Commands the Muslims to slaughter all disbelievers all the time as you declared above.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama How does it not suggest abrogation? Just because you say it doesnt does not mean it doesnt. Integrity is a the complete opposite for a Muslim. You can add or dismiss whatever you want and make it up as you go along in order to defend or propagate Islam. You think if you just say something it becomes a fact. Jalalayn says, and I quote " this was [revealed] before the command to struggle against them."

That means the orders were changed. Are you in a mental institution Osama?

LOL! Nobody can tell me for sure what Islam is. You are not arguing with me now, you are arguing with Jalalayns who were two of the greatest scholars of Islam. Thats conjecture dummy. LOL!

Again making claims and the providing evidence are two different things. And Muslims cant seem to be sure what Islam and Mohamed cammands! Lets take a look! LOL! And what I said was that islam commands the subjugation of all No9n Muslims or the slaughter of all non Muslims! If I dont submit to the will of Muslims by converting to your death cult, or, by paying the jizya then the punishment is death! That is called compulsion!

Now read on and tell me how Islam is solid and unchanged!
Search 4 Truth said...: Allah declares that without doubt, Muhammad is truly His Messenger,
(Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.) and this quality includes every beautiful description. Allah praises the Companions of the Messenger , may Allah be pleased with them all,
(And those who are with him are severe against disbelievers, merciful among themselves.) just as He, the Exalted and Most Honored, said in another Ayah,
(Allah will bring a people whom He will love and they will love Him; humble towards the believers, stern towards the disbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).)(5:54) This is the description of the believers; harsh with the disbelievers, merciful and kind to the believers, angry without smiling before the disbelievers, smiling and beaming with pleasure before his believing brother. Allah the Exalted said in another Ayah,
(O you who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are close to you, and let them find harshness in you.) (9:123) The Prophet said,
(The parable of the believers in their kindness and mercy for each other, is that of the body: when one of its organs falls ill, the rest of the body responds with fever and sleeplessness.) The Prophet also said,
(A believer to another believer is like a building whose different parts enforce each other.)
Qualities of the Faithful Believers and Their Refinement
Tafsir Ibn Kathir

I went out with my father to Syria. The people passed by the cloisters in which there were Christians and began to salute them. My father said: Do not give them salutation first, for AbuHurayrah reported the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) as saying: Do not salute them (Jews and Christians) first, and when you meet them on the road, force them to go to the narrowest part of it.
Abu Dawud 41:5186 , See also: Sahih Muslim 26:5389, Sahih Muslim 26:5390

Narrated Anas bin Malik:
Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.' And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally and their reckoning will be with Allah." Narrated Maimun ibn Siyah that he asked Anas bin Malik,
"O Abu Hamza! What makes the life and property of a person sacred?" He replied, "Whoever says, 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah', faces our Qibla during the prayers, prays like us and eats our slaughtered animal, then he is a Muslim, and has got the same rights and obligations as other Muslims have."
Sahih Bukhari 1:8:387, See also: Sahih Bukhari 1:2:24

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam; and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush, [at every] route that they use (kulla, ‘every', is in the accusative because a [preceding] genitive-taking preposition has been removed). But if they repent, of unbelief, and establish prayer and pay the alms, then leave their way free, and do not interfere with them. God is Forgiving, Merciful, to those who repent.

So we either accept Islam, be second class citizens, and extorted from, or we die.

What I said was absolutely 100% accurate. Your nonsense ramblings and excuses can be seen through from a mile away!
Search 4 Truth said...: Again I said subjugation or slaughter. We convert, or accept submission and get extorted from and live under an apartheid like system, or we die.

The penalties that the Sharia has introduced for those who disobey God and his Messengers of two kinds: the punishment of those who are under the sway [of an imam], both individuals and collectivities, as has been mentioned before [in the chapter on criminal law], and, secondly, the punishment of recalcitrant groups, such as those that can only be brought under the sway of the Imam by a decisive fight. That then is the jihad against the unbelievers (kuffar), the enemies of God and His Messenger. For whoever has heard the summons of the Messenger of God, Peace be upon him, and has not responded to it must be fought, "until there is no Fitna and the religion of God's entirely" (K. 2:193, 8:39).[4]
Ibn Taymiyyah, ‘Governance According to Allaah's Law in Reforming the Ruler and his Flock'

"Since lawful warfare is essentially Jihad and since its aim is that religion is entirely for Allah and the word of Allah is uppermost, therefore, according to all Muslims, those who stand in the way of this aim must be fought.[5]
Ibn Taymiyyah, ‘Governance According to Allaah's Law in Reforming the Ruler and his Flock'

When the Prophet died and Abu Bakr became his successor and some of the Arabs reverted to disbelief, 'Umar said, "O Abu Bakr! How can you fight these people although Allah's Apostle said, 'I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah, 'and whoever said, 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah', Allah will save his property and his life from me
Sahih Bukhari 9:84:59, See also: Sahih Bukhari 2:23:483
Search 4 Truth said...: So as you can see this ayat was abrogated by the later ones that command Muslims to fight, subjugate or slaughter all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus).

You live a lie and you spew lies!

That was copied from above. It says subjugate OR slaughter. I will repeat it once again. We either convert to your evil, fascist, bigoted, misogynistic death cult, are subjugated, oppressed, and extorted from, or we die! You are the liar!

Search 4 Truth said...: Hey Osama

Your still not practicing Islam correctly. You are not Allah or Mohamed.

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ وَقَاتِلُواْ فِي سَبِيلِ ٱللَّهِ ٱلَّذِينَ يُقَاتِلُونَكُمْ وَلاَ تَعْتَدُوۤاْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لاَ يُحِبُّ ٱلْمُعْتَدِينَ }

After the Prophet (s) was prevented from [visiting] the House in the year of the battle of Hudaybiyya, he made a pact with the disbelievers that he would be allowed to return the following year, at which time they would vacate Mecca for three days. Having prepared to depart for the Visitation [‘umra], [he and] the believers were concerned that Quraysh would not keep to the agreement and instigate fighting. The Muslims were averse to becoming engaged in fighting while in a state of pilgrimage inviolability in the Sacred Enclosure [al-haram] and during the sacred months, and so the following was revealed: And fight in the way of God, to elevate His religion, with those who fight against you, the disbelievers, but aggress not, against them by initiating the fighting; God loves not the aggressors, the ones that overstep the bounds which God has set for them: this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā'a, ‘immunity' [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:

IT WAS ABROGATED BY 9:1

Looks like Jallayan agrees with me as well. So where is this Islam that is so solid and unchanged. I cant seem to find it. Are you the only one who knows solid Islam? LOL!

Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan (http://www.aalalbayt.org) ® All Rights Reserved; Search 4 Truth,

Again, Jalalyn didn't say abrogated, and couldn't dare to say it was abrogated. Plus, many of these big volumes were written by their students and students' students. And again, no two "scholars" agree on the amount of Noble Verses that were abrogated, and what Noble Verse abrogates what Noble Verse.

I am glad that you're a Syrian, since one of your countrymen, who is a rising Scholar, named Adnan Al Refaei and other modern-day scholars have come on TV and wiped the floor (in formal and professional debates) with those who tried to say that the Holy Quran abrogates Itself by the wholesale with facts. Adnan and others have showed and proved clearly that there are no abrogations in the Holy Quran. JALALYN CAN CLAIM WHATEVER THEY WANT. THEY'RE BOOKS ARE NOT THE QURAN, NOR ARE ALLAH ALMIGHTY, NOR IS HE THE PROPHET. ***************And again, they never said the Noble Verses that I gave were abrogated. A Law coming after a Law means that we now have a dynamic situation and not just a fixed one. That's all it means. No contradiction, no abrogation, no BS, no lies.

YOU SAID:

"And what I said was that islam commands the subjugation of all No9n Muslims or the slaughter of all non Muslims!"

RESPONSE:

You're now taking back your own words after I exposed you to be a liar. "...all non Muslims!" is an absolute statement that suggests that I can go and slaughter people (men, women and children) by the mass like what happened in Colorado and Norway. This is what the liars like you who go on FoxNOISE such as Robert Spencer and Pat Robertson and other criminals say about Islam. They make absolute statements that they know are false. When I simply challenged your absolute phony statement, it didn't take much for you to get exposed proven to be a liar. So I am glad that you're now put in your place, because it'll make the communication between us a bit easier. I WANT YOU TO COME BACK AND SAY THAT ISLAM DOESN'T PERMIT THE SLAUGHTER OF ALL NON Muslims (men, women and children). If not, then tell us why. Your silence will prove that you're a phony liar.

Now, when Allah Almighty Commands the Muslims to treat with kindness and justice the disbelievers who are under them, and to feed the captives **********FOR THE LOVE OF ALLAH ALMIGHTY, then this proves the following:

1- Allah Almighty is a Loving GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). Yes, a Loving GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).

2- Allah Almighty is a Just and Kind GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).

3- Allah Almighty's Commands about us being kind to our captives certainly disproves your claims, since after battle (all the Laws of battle have now been applied), the Muslims must come back to compassion and mercy. Yes, there is hoestility against paganism and disbelievers, but in the end, we must come back to mercy and compassion.

Can you refute this, Search 4 Truth?

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
: And one more point that will CRUSH your nonsense, Search4Truth is this:

In every battle that the Muslims have fought, the Prophet had always given the following commands:

1- Do not destroy or corrupt the land.

2- Do cut trees or kill animals for the sake of harm.

3- DO NOT KILL AN INNOCENT UNARMED PERSON, OR A SOLDIER WHO DROPS HIS WEAPON!

There is an incident where Khalid bin Walid killed a disbeliever who became unarmed during battle and was captured. The Prophet threw sand in Khalid's face and said his famous Saying:

"Allahumma inni baree'a min ma fa'ala Khalid"

"O Allah, I am innocent from what Khalid has done."

So don't come a tell me utter nonsense such as my Verses are not applicable today, Search4Truth.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
Search 4 Truth said...: Osama are you blind? Or does Allah seal your eyes, ears and mind? Jalalayn DOES SAY ABROGATE! Go here everyone and see for yourself.

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=2&tAyahNo=190&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ وَقَاتِلُواْ فِي سَبِيلِ ٱللَّهِ ٱلَّذِينَ يُقَاتِلُونَكُمْ وَلاَ تَعْتَدُوۤاْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لاَ يُحِبُّ ٱلْمُعْتَدِينَ }

After the Prophet (s) was prevented from [visiting] the House in the year of the battle of Hudaybiyya, he made a pact with the disbelievers that he would be allowed to return the following year, at which time they would vacate Mecca for three days. Having prepared to depart for the Visitation [‘umra], [he and] the believers were concerned that Quraysh would not keep to the agreement and instigate fighting. The Muslims were averse to becoming engaged in fighting while in a state of pilgrimage inviolability in the Sacred Enclosure [al-haram] and during the sacred months, and so the following was revealed: And fight in the way of God, to elevate His religion, with those who fight against you, the disbelievers, but aggress not, against them by initiating the fighting; God loves not the aggressors, the ones that overstep the bounds which God has set for them: this stipulation was abrogated by the verse of barā'a, ‘immunity' [Q. 9:1], or by His saying [below]:

Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan (http://www.aalalbayt.org) ® All Rights Reserved\

DENIAL OF REALITY IS NOT A REBUTTAL!

So now you admit that Islam is not solid and consistant. If no two scholars can agree on anything then how can you claim it to be solid? LOL! You just contradict yourself constantly!

Quote " And again, no two "scholars" agree on the amount of Noble Verses that were abrogated, and what Noble Verse abrogates what Noble Verse."

So nobody knows how to follow Islam according to you. You just said it! LOL! Your the perfect example of what Islam does to the mind and integrity of people!
Search 4 Truth said...: No Osama. I reprinted the exact words i said. Now this will be the third time I am going to repost the same thing. EVERYONE can see you are the liar! Go up and read it liar!

So as you can see this ayat was abrogated by the later ones that command Muslims to fight, subjugate or slaughter all non Muslims for all time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus).

You live a lie and you spew lies!

July 28, 2012 11:29 AM

You are exposed AGAIN! Everyone can see what i said. Whats wrong with you?
Search 4 Truth said...: ISLAM COMMANDS ALL Muslims FOR ALL TIME TO SUBJUGATE OR SLAUGHTER ALL NON Muslims FOR ALL TIME! That is an absolute FACT!

Like I proved many times over. If we do not submit to Islam, convert, or accept second class, apartheid like status, then you can kill us! I proved it! And yes you can kill a non Muslim child if you think he will grow up to be a non Muslim!

The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) used not to kill the children, so thou shouldst not kill them unless you could know what Khadir had known about the child he killed, or you could distinguish between a child who would grow up to he a believer (and a child who would grow up to be a non-believer), so that you killed the (prospective) non-believer and left the (prospective) believer aside. (Sahih Muslim 4457)

See where it says OR you could distinguish between a child that would grow up to be a non Muslim, and a child that would be a Muslim.

That "OR" is a qualifier. It gives you the right to make that distinction!

You have been exposed as a liar, and you contradict yourself.

You cannot say Islam is clear, and then in the next breath say that no scholar can agree on what is abrogated and what is not. Especially when earlier you said, Quote". The lie of abrogation that was born from ignorance has no place in Islam."

Now your saying there is abrogation but nobody is sure what is and isnt. So Islam is not clear. Thank you. This is why you are one of the worst apologists for Islam, but great for the kafre.
Search 4 Truth said...: Osama making claims and then providing evidence are two entirely different things! Here i will show you. LOL!

It is reported on the authority of Sa'b b. Jaththama that the Prophet of Allah (may peace be upon him), when asked about the women and children of the polytheists being killed during the night raid, said: "They are from them." (Sahih Muslim 4322, see also Bukhari 52:256)

"The Prophet had suddenly attacked Bani Mustaliq without warning while they were heedless and their cattle were being watered at the places of water. Their fighting men were killed and their women and children were taken as captives" (Bukhari 46:717)

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam; and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush, [at every] route that they use (kulla, ‘every', is in the accusative because a [preceding] genitive-taking preposition has been removed). But if they repent, of unbelief, and establish prayer and pay the alms, then leave their way free, and do not interfere with them. God is Forgiving, Merciful, to those who repent.

So take them captive, and imprison them. And if they accept Islam let them go. If they do not, MURDER THEM! See it dummy? It's clear for all to see.

YOUR DENIAL, DELUSIONS, AND ILLUSIONS, are not a rebuttal.

Search 4 Truth said...: @ Foolster.

Everyone can see he has no integrity. He lies, misrepresents, slanders, demonizes,uses logical fallacies, and is completely inconsistent. This is exactly what happens to anyone who clings to the lie of Islam. You have to be void of critical thinking, objective reasoning, and intellectual integrity to be a Muslim and try and defend it and reinvent it. Now he will just move on as if nothing happened and he wasnt refuted. It's quite sad and pathetic!
: "Like I proved many times over. If we do not submit to Islam, convert, or accept second class, apartheid like status, then you can kill us!"

I am not sure I agree with you on the "second class apartheid like status". The Jizyah that the infidels had to pay IN HUMILIATION was due to hostility. It was a punishment for them. This Law doesn't apply to all disbelievers, exactly as the Law of Apostatasy also doesn't apply to all of those who leave Islam. You're taking Statements out of our Holy Quran and you're making them absolute statements that apply to everybody. This is where you're wrong.

"And yes you can kill a non Muslim child if you think he will grow up to be a non Muslim!

The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) used not to kill the children, so thou shouldst not kill them unless you could know what Khadir had known about the child he killed, or you could distinguish between a child who would grow up to he a believer (and a child who would grow up to be a non-believer), so that you killed the (prospective) non-believer and left the (prospective) believer aside. (Sahih Muslim 4457)"

The hate that you're filled with had obviously blinded you to read the obvious. The Prophet of Islam NEVER KILLED ANY CHILD. His Saying said that we must never kill any child because we will never be like Prophet Khidir, peace be upon him, who killed one child because Allah Almighty Revealed to him that the child will put his parents through much hardship and he'll be an infidel. ************The Hadith that you quoted is an affirmation that we must never even think about killing children.

(continued)
: "It is reported on the authority of Sa'b b. Jaththama that the Prophet of Allah (may peace be upon him), when asked about the women and children of the polytheists being killed during the night raid, said: "They are from them." (Sahih Muslim 4322, see also Bukhari 52:256)

"The Prophet had suddenly attacked Bani Mustaliq without warning while they were heedless and their cattle were being watered at the places of water. Their fighting men were killed and their women and children were taken as captives" (Bukhari 46:717)"

Again, your hate is preventing you from seeing the simple text! The Muslims, being compassionate and considerate, approached the Prophet during battle saying that the women and children ARE GETTING TRAMPLED AND KILLED BECAUSE THEY WERE CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE. The Prophet said they are from them. This is very simple and I don't know why it is very difficult for you to see it. *************It is not saying that the Muslims can SINGLE OUT WOMEN AND CHILDREN AND SLAUGHTER THEM! I hope you're not that ridiculous. It simply says do not stop the battle because of them. We'll have to make it an exception, because they are INNOCENT ONES FROM THEM AND NOT FROM US.

(continued)
: "* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam; and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush, [at every] route that they use (kulla, ‘every', is in the accusative because a [preceding] genitive-taking preposition has been removed). But if they repent, of unbelief, and establish prayer and pay the alms, then leave their way free, and do not interfere with them. God is Forgiving, Merciful, to those who repent.

So take them captive, and imprison them. And if they accept Islam let them go. If they do not, MURDER THEM! See it dummy? It's clear for all to see."

Again, YOUR FAILING TO READ SIMPLE TEXT. The Noble Verse Says:

1- Fight the infidels and ambush them and do what is necessary to defeat them.

2- ***********A CAPTIVE WHO IS HELD BY YOU IS TO BE RELEASED IMMEDIATELY IF HE MEETS A CERTAIN CONDITION: EMBRACES ISLAM, PRAYS AND PAYS CHARITY TO THE POOR.

3- This Noble Verse doesn't say to kill the captives.

Mr. Search4Truth, you have still failed to answer my challenge to you above, which is this:

****************************
MY CHALLENGE TO SEARCH4TRUTH:
*******************************
As I have provided the Noble Verses above (WHICH BY THE WAY YOUR QUOTATIONS DIDN'T EVEN ADDRESS THEM NOR "ABROGATE" THEM), when Allah Almighty Commands the Muslims to treat with kindness and justice the disbelievers who are under them, and to feed the captives FOR THE LOVE OF ALLAH ALMIGHTY as the Holy Quran explicitly claims, then this proves the following:

1- Allah Almighty is a Loving GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). Yes, a Loving GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).

2- Allah Almighty is a Just and Kind GOD (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him).

3- Allah Almighty's Commands about us being kind to our captives certainly disproves your claims, since after battle (all the Laws of battle have now been applied), the Muslims must come back to compassion and mercy. Yes, there is hoestility against paganism and disbelievers, but in the end, we must come back to mercy and compassion.

Can you refute this, Search 4 Truth?

Even in your quotes above, sir, the Prophet of Islam never killed a child, never ordered the killing of any child or innocent, nor did he torture captives, nor did he kill captives.

Again Mr. Search4Truth, can you honestly refute this!

Let me end this by telling you this. Islam is bigger than the hostile times that it grew in. Islam is big, very big on Mercy, Love and Compassion. Allah Almighty Commanded us to treat WITH KINDNESS AND JUSTICE the peaceful disbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). If your quotes showed some Muslim bullies, well my quotes showed that Allah Almighty rebuked them and fixed them.

So much for the "second-class status" nonsense.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
: " Foolster41 said...
Did you notice he called critics of Islam like Robert Spencer "criminals"? It seems he thinks the law in Sharia should apply in the US/west, and they should be charged for critisizing Islam?"

RESPONSE:

When one fabricates lies on Islam, or anything, then he becomes a sick demon, especially when his words could harm millions. The Norway slaughter happened because of a sicko that listened to this quack and buffoon, Robert Spencer.

On a side note stupidster, your NT says that if a believer calls another believer a "fool", then he will be standing on the edge of Hell. So every time any of your brothers even addresses you, you are making them fall into this sin, stupidster.

So I suggest you change your stupid name, and slap some integrity and honesty in you, because I never said that anyone who criticizes Islam is a criminal. Show me where I said that.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

: More Noble Verses for Mr. Search4Truth:

[005:008] O ye who believe! stand out firmly for God, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear God (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). For God is well-acquainted with all that ye do.

So Mr. Search4Truth, if the Muslims have a problem or war with a group of people, this is NEVER AN EXCUSE TO DEAL UNJUSTLY WITH ANY OF THEIR COUNTRYMEN THAT ONE MIGHT RUN INTO.

[003:018] There is no god but He: That is the witness of God, His angels, and those endued with knowledge, standing firm on justice. There is no god but He, the Exalted in Power, the Wise.

I can provide you at least 20 more Noble Verses, Search4Truth. You have Islam ALL MISUNDERSTOOD my brother.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
: Furthermore,

By Allah Almighty's Holy Name I am not BSing or lying. If I were to stand before a human-judge, then I would feel far far far more comfortable standing before a Muslim judge than say a Pagan one, or even a Christian one, especially one that belongs to the modern-day hateful neo-cons and zionists. I know that a Muslim judge has higher probability of being fair and just with everyone.

Islam is big, VERY BIG, on justice. It is no joke in Islam. And the Prophet has many Sayings about how the people of knowledge and the leaders AND THE JUDGES will be the ones who will receive the most severe punishments.

I hope this helps.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
: "So you admit that in Islam, Allah allows you to lie. Therefore, you are correct that Allah did abrogate the law which He gave to the Jews, e.g., in the Ten Commandment "Thou shall not lie". Let me tell you something about the true and living God of the Bible (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). God is pure and holy. There is no evil in it, nor there can any evil exit in His presence. When God say, "thou shall not lie", Satan says the opposite, "thou can lie". Since lying is evil, therefore God can not say that you can lie nor He will ever permit His follower to lie.

What do we conclude?"

RESPONSE:

Actually, the OT doesn't say "thou shalt not lie". This command was latter said in the first book of Corinthians 3,500 years after. The Command that you're looking for is:

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. (From the KJV Bible, Exodus 20:16)"

Visit: https://www.answering-christianity.com/quran_ten_commandments.htm

As to what do we conclude? We conclude that you're here to spam and to waste time and text, by drowning the text with nonsense. I've already responded to your lies and said that Islam doesn't permit lying, unless one is under a threat. And It's 100% permitted in your Scriptures as well. So you have just insulted your own faith.

Furthermore, I've given you the proofs and quotes about Paul himself in the NT said that if he has to lie to people to draw them to faith, then he has no problem doing it. So Paul permitted lying to bring people to Christianity.

Read my references above before making fun of yourself.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
Search 4 Truth said...: Osama

Quote "I am not sure I agree with you on the "second class apartheid like status". The Jizyah that the infidels had to pay IN HUMILIATION was due to hostility. It was a punishment for them. This Law doesn't apply to all disbelievers, exactly as the Law of Apostatasy also doesn't apply to all of those who leave Islam. You're taking Statements out of our Holy Quran and you're making them absolute statements that apply to everybody. This is where you're wrong."

Response - Provide evidence for your assertions.

Quote "The hate that you're filled with had obviously blinded you to read the obvious. The Prophet of Islam NEVER KILLED ANY CHILD. His Saying said that we must never kill any child because we will never be like Prophet Khidir, peace be upon him, who killed one child because Allah Almighty Revealed to him that the child will put his parents through much hardship and he'll be an infidel. ************The Hadith that you quoted is an affirmation that we must never even think about killing children."

False. They are directions on who till kill and who to leave aside! Like it says! Your delusional!

Response

so that you killed the (prospective) non-believer and left the (prospective) believer aside. (Sahih Muslim 4457)

LOL! it is saying to kill the non Muslim child, and leave the Muslim child alone! Your mind and soul is twisted by Islam!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

You are a liar and have absolutely NO integrity at all! He said, "they are from them" Meaning do not be concerned with them. How you can try and think that you could get away this lie is beyond me! He is disregarding their safety because they are from them! You have NO integrity at ALL!

They are asking him about the children and Mohamed disregards their safety or lives by clearly saying, do not worry about them, they are from them! Thats bigotry and infanticide!

You are delusional!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Yes thats what I said. The criteria is accepting Islam, or DEATH!

"* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam;

Its as clear as the growing nose on your face!

ACCEPT ISLAM! OR DIE!

Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

I have refuted it countless times. But Islam has destroyed your ability for simple reasoning.

First of all 60:* was abrogated by the later ayats of subjugation OR murder!

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn 60:8
this was [revealed] before the command to struggle against them. Assuredly God loves the just.

Yes he did torture captives. And the hadith says that you should kill a child if you think he will grow up to be a non Muslim!. Denial of reality is not a rebuttal!

Now I am sure your going to say this is not torture. Like all of your other ridiculous ramblings!

Qur'an 5:33 "The punishment for those who wage war against Allah and His Prophet and make mischief in the land, is to murder them, crucify them, or cut off a hand and foot on opposite sides...their doom is dreadful. They will not escape the fire, suffering constantly."

Tabari VIII:122
Ishaq:515 "The Prophet gave orders concerning Kinanah to Zubayr, saying, 'Torture him until you root out and extract what he has. So Zubayr kindled a fire on Kinanah's chest, twirling it with his firestick until Kinanah was near death. Then the Messenger gave him to Maslamah, who beheaded him."

Now I am sure you are going to say commanding someone to torture another is not torturing, correct? LOL!

Every single thing you say Osama is a LIE! EVERYTHING!

Ishaq:595 "The Apostle said, 'Get him away from me and cut off his tongue.'"

Ishaq:312 "Umar said to the Apostle, 'Let me pull out Suhayl's two front teeth. That way his tongue will stick out and he will never be able to speak against you again.'"

Tabari VII:133
Ishaq:387 "When Muhammad saw Hamzah he said, 'If Allah gives me victory over the Quraysh at any time, I shall mutilate thirty of their men!' When the Muslims saw the rage of the Prophet they said, 'By Allah, if we are victorious over them, we shall mutilate them in a way which no Arab has ever mutilated anybody."
Tabari VIII:96 "A raiding party led by Zayd set out against Umm in Ramadan. During it, Umm suffered a cruel death. Zyad tied her legs with rope and then tied her between two camels until they split her in two. She was a very old woman. Then they brought Umm's daughter and Abdallah to the Messenger. Umm's daughter belonged to Salamah who had captured her. Muhammad asked Salamah for her, and Salamah gave her to him."

And no Muslim did anything without the direct or indirect consent of your death cult leader!


Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Justice is a different thing in Islam than it is to the rest of the civilized world. As you can see here!

He who kills a believing soul intentionally, Allah makes the Fire of Hell his abode, He will become angry with him, and curse him, and has prepared a tremendous punishment for him, equal to if he had killed all people, his punishment will still be the same.
Human Beings Should Respect the Sanctity of Other Human Beings
Tafsir Ibn Kathir

A non Muslim does not have equal rights and not perceived as an equal in anything, including jurisprudence!

Narrated Anas bin Malik:
Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.' And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally and their reckoning will be with Allah." Narrated Maimun ibn Siyah that he asked Anas bin Malik,
"O Abu Hamza! What makes the life and property of a person sacred?" He replied, "Whoever says, 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah', faces our Qibla during the prayers, prays like us and eats our slaughtered animal, then he is a Muslim, and has got the same rights and obligations as other Muslims have."
Sahih Bukhari 1:8:387, See also: Sahih Bukhari 1:2:24

Now either you are a LIAR! Or completly ignorant of Islam and its doctrine! Oh wait, you said Islam is solid, no, you said no scholar agrees, wait. What is Islam again? It seems you can rationalize just about anything depending on the weather, the day, the person, the mood. Islam is the most vile, evil, ideology man has ever concocted.
Search 4 Truth said...: Osama,

All you ramblings do is help to show how ambiguous and immoral Islam is!

I asked 'Ali "Do you have anything Divine literature besides what is in the Qur'an?" Or, as Uyaina once said, "Apart from what the people have?" 'Ali said, "By Him Who made the grain split (germinate) and created the soul, we have nothing except what is in the Quran and the ability (gift) of understanding Allah's Book which He may endow a man, with and what is written in this sheet of paper." I asked, "What is on this paper?" He replied, "The legal regulations of Diya (Blood-money) and the (ransom for) releasing of the captives, and the judgment that no Muslim should be killed in Qisas (equality in punishment) for killing a Kafir (disbeliever)."
Sahih Bukhari 9:83:50, See also: Sahih Bukhari 1:3:111, and Sahih Bukhari 4:52:283

Now is that justice and equality? You live a lie, and you spew lies! And you are completly refuted. And you know what? It didn't take me long at all.

Now what were you saying about Islam being solid again? How do you live with yourself? How do you look yourself in the mirror and say that it is ok to spread the lies and nonsense that you do?

A delusion is a belief held with strong conviction despite superior evidence to the contrary.[1] Unlike hallucinations, delusions are always pathological (the result of an illness or illness process).

An illusion is a distortion of the senses, revealing how the brain normally organizes and interprets sensory stimulation. While illusions distort reality

The Dunning-Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which unskilled individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly rating their ability much higher than average. This bias is attributed to a metacognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their mistakes.
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Thanks for saying Allah is a bully!
Remember Sura 9 was one of the last revealed!

Quran (48:29) - "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves"

009.030
YUSUFALI: The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!

Imprison them and if the accept Islam, let them go, if they dont murder them! Thats Allah!

9.028
YUSUFALI: O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean; so let them not, after this year of theirs, approach the Sacred Mosque. And if ye fear poverty, soon will Allah enrich you, if He wills, out of His bounty, for Allah is All-knowing, All-wise.

Kick all the non Muslims out of their homes and their place of commerce. Where people of all races and religions were gathering for trade. Thats kindness and justice!

9.029
YUSUFALI: Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

Attack all non Muslims in non Islamic country and force them to pay protection money (like the mafia), and feel themselves subdued (do you want Ibn kathirs tafsir? 0r and accept apartheid like existence of subservience, or be murdered!

Abu Ishaq said that he heard al-Bara' b 'Azib (Allah be pleased with him) say: The last complete sura revealed (in the Holy Qur'an) is Sura tauba (i e. al-Bara'at, ix.), and the last verse revealed is that pertaining to Kalala.
Sahih Muslim 11:3941

O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him).
Qur'an 9:123

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Recite Verse
Open in new window
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{ يٰأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ قَاتِلُواْ ٱلَّذِينَ يَلُونَكُمْ مِّنَ ٱلْكُفَّارِ وَلْيَجِدُواْ فِيكُمْ غِلْظَةً وَٱعْلَمُوۤاْ أَنَّ ٱللَّهَ مَعَ ٱلْمُتَّقِينَ }

O you who believe, fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, that is, the nearest, followed by the next nearest of them, and let them find harshness in you, that is, severity, in other words, be harsh with them, and know that God is with the pious, helping and granting [them] victory.

Ah the kindness and justice of Islam. Osama, you are among the deceived! Get down on your hands and knees, pray for God to show you the truth. Accept Christ. And you will have an instant awakening from your darkness hypocrisy and logical fallacies. I dont hate you in any way. I admit I dislike your tactics and willful ignorance. But i do love you. You are just a victim. I feel for you. Wake up!

"Quote "I am not sure I agree with you on the "second class apartheid like status". The Jizyah that the infidels had to pay IN HUMILIATION was due to hostility. It was a punishment for them. This Law doesn't apply to all disbelievers, exactly as the Law of Apostatasy also doesn't apply to all of those who leave Islam. You're taking Statements out of our Holy Quran and you're making them absolute statements that apply to everybody. This is where you're wrong."

Response - Provide evidence for your assertions."

******************
RESPONSE:
*********************
The evidence is the following points:

1-The Islamic State is responsible for providing protection to all citizens or subjects. I think we both agree on this one.

2- If one citizen or subject violates another, then the law of the land applies. This is where Allah Almighty's Commands, such as the following, come in:

[004:059] O ye who believe! Obey God, and obey the Apostle, and those charged with authority among you. If ye differ in anything among yourselves, refer it to God and His Apostle, if ye do believe in God and the Last Day: That is best, and most suitable for final determination.

You're again making the mistake of making everything absolute in the Holy Quran, and worse in the narrations and stories outside the Holy Quran. You can't do that, nor do Scholars agree with you on this. This is why in all of the Muslim states that had Christians living in them, such as Egypt, Syria and others that used Islam in their civil courts, the murderer gets executed regardless of the religion of his victim so long the victim is also a citizen of the country. In Egypt, where the Al-Azhar Islamic Institution had ruled all of the civil affairs of the country for many centuries, the Muslim would get executed if he murdered a Coptic or any non-Muslim citizen. This is a fact that you can not dispute. Period!

***************************
I CHALLENGE YOU TO REFUTE THIS POINT. And you have yet to respond to all of my challenges that I posed to you above as well. You have ignored all of them by brushing them aside.
******************************

(continued)
: You can sit here and quote me narrations and stories about specific situations and battles that happened 1,500 years ago all you want. But none of your quotes stand, because none of them are CLEAR-CUT ABSOLUTE LAWS. And as the Holy Quran is Crystal Clear about following the Law of the land, Allah Almighty also left the following of the RULING AUTHORITY OPEN in the Holy Quran, based on the State or the Community. I mean, who else beside Prophet Muhammad was a ruling authority back when these Noble Verses were revealed? No one! Yet, despite that, we still do have Noble Verses that Command not only following the Ruling Authority, but to also establishing democracy among us (voting and following the ruling of the majority and so on):

[042:038] Those who hearken to their Lord, and establish regular Prayer; who (conduct) their affairs by mutual Consultation; who spend out of what We bestow on them for Sustenance;

"Quote "The hate that you're filled with had obviously blinded you to read the obvious. The Prophet of Islam NEVER KILLED ANY CHILD. His Saying said that we must never kill any child because we will never be like Prophet Khidir, peace be upon him, who killed one child because Allah Almighty Revealed to him that the child will put his parents through much hardship and he'll be an infidel. ************The Hadith that you quoted is an affirmation that we must never even think about killing children."

False. They are directions on who till kill and who to leave aside! Like it says! Your delusional!"

******************
RESPONSE:
*********************
No, you're very wrong and superficial and wasting of time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus). Plus, you're now pretending that you don't know Arabic idioms and styles of speech.

1-The Holy Quran is clear about no one knows what the future holds.

2-Allah Almighty also Said that ONLY HE KNOWS WHAT'S IN THE HEARTS AND MINDS OF PEOPLE.

3- In Islam everyone is a Muslim by FITRAH (while their helpless and clueless children who can't think for themselves and decide for themselves). Every child is a Muslim in Islam.

4- The Prophet said (sacrasticly) that if you know which child will become a hostile infidel when he grows up, then go ahead and kill it. I Muhammad never and will never kill any child because I don't know who will become a Muslim and will be a hostile enemy to Allah Almighty.

5- There are even many many Hadiths about the Prophet saying that he doesn't even know what will HAPPEN TO HIM PERSONALLY IN THIS LIFE AND IN THE HEREAFTER!

You still don't get it, do you?

(continued)
: "You are a liar and have absolutely NO integrity at all! He said, "they are from them" Meaning do not be concerned with them. How you can try and think that you could get away this lie is beyond me! He is disregarding their safety because they are from them! You have NO integrity at ALL!"

******************
RESPONSE:
*********************
The battle had to be won. It was an unfortunate situation that women and children got in the way. The reason why you're holding to this for dear life (this is the only quote that you could ever produce about "killing of children") is becasue you're bankrupt. The Prophet never ordered the Muslims to go and kill any child or any civilian OR EVEN ANY SOLDIER THAT SURRENDERS OR DROPS HIS WEAPON. On the contrary, the Prophet commanded the protection of those people. So you're bankrupt and have nothing but noise and empty rants regarding this point.

"Yes thats what I said. The criteria is accepting Islam, or DEATH!

"* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam;

Its as clear as the growing nose on your face!"

******************
RESPONSE:
*********************
You are a liar, becasue the Arabic text doesn't say "until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam;". You are a liar and you know it. Where does the Arabic say that. COME BACK AND QUOTE THE PORTION THAT SAYS EXACTLY THIS FROM THE ARABIC THAT YOU PROVIDED. Let's see your silly attempts to weasel out of this one with your name-calling and drowning of text. It's criminals like you, Search4Truth, who come on FoxNOISE and make these false statements. They are criminals becasue they give falsehood to criminals like them to hate and kill innocent people based on falsehood and lies and false paranoia.

Anyway, enough for now. You seem that you want to drown the text on purpose. You have not even addressed any of my challenges above about Allah Almighty's LOVE, COMPASSION, KINDNESS AND MERCY that He Commanded the Muslims to practice on the disbelievers (Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus' sins and was "charitable" with him). Show me where they are even "abrogated" according to any text that you have! You have none.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
: Ok one more for you, Search4Truth....

"@ Osama

I have refuted it countless times. But Islam has destroyed your ability for simple reasoning.

First of all 60:* was abrogated by the later ayats of subjugation OR murder!

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn 60:8
this was [revealed] before the command to struggle against them. Assuredly God loves the just."

RESONSE:

I say this has got to be the funniest "refutation" you have come up with. You again, inserted words into the Jalayns' mouths by saying that they said that the Noble Verse was abrogated.

Let me get this straight for you Mr. Search4Truth:

1- Love and the Love of Allah Almighty are deeply rooted in the Holy Quran. It is so rooted that Allah Almighty even praises the Christians for having this quality in them.

2- For you to come here and say that the LOVE OF ALLAH ALMIGHTY is now all gone in the Holy Quran shows how silly you are, and how silly and ridiculous any Muslim would be if he/she were to utter this nonsense.

There are no "abrogations" sir. The Jalalyns are again pointing out a dynamic rulings in the Holy Quran, where one can be applied for exceptional cases.

**********IN FACT, IN VERY YOUR OWN QUOTE ABOVE, they're suggesting that the bigger and more general and more abroader LAW IS THE ONE THAT I MENTIONED, while the smaller and more specific one to a certain situation is the one you mentioned.

Let us read your quote again:

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn 60:8
this was [revealed] before the command to struggle against them. Assuredly God loves the just.

Do you still not get it?

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama.

LOL! You are still clinging to these logical fallacies. Without equality, there can NEVER be justice. And non Muslims do not hold equality under Islam.

1. Guards in prisons are also responsible for providing protection for the inmates.

2. Irrelevant

Quote from Osama "You're again making the mistake of making everything absolute in the Holy Quran, and worse in the narrations and stories outside the Holy Quran. You can't do that, nor do Scholars agree with you on this"

Quote from Osama " Islam is solid and unchanged."First of all, no two Muslim "scholars" agree on the amount of the Noble Verses that were "abrogated" (notice the double quotes here), nor on what Noble Verses supposedly abrogated what Noble Verses."

It seems to me its another case of a Muslims saying whatever he has to say in order to defend Islam. No matter how many times you contradict yourself and use logical fallacies. You think if you give any answer even if it contradicts your previous one, it is a response! well it is a response, but it is inconsistent! Like Islam, and you, and your scholars, and your false hypocrite Prophet!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Quote " This is why in all of the Muslim states that had Christians living in them, such as Egypt, Syria and others that used Islam in their civil courts, the murderer gets executed regardless of the religion of his victim so long the victim is also a citizen of the country."

So your saying that those nations and laws created by man are more moral and just than your Allahs and Prophets! You just explained to us how Islamic jurisprudence is inferior to the secular laws of Islamic nations! You are awesome! Thank you.

What is the point of Mohamed saying that no Muslim should be killed for killing a kafre if it is not the best, most appropriate way in the eyes of Allah? LOL! This is amazing.

You are fabricating Islam, dismissing the sahih hadith, and reinventing it. This is pathetic!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Maybe Allah has sealed your eyes, ears and mind. But I responded to all of them! Claiming I didn't does not mean I didn't. Repost the question and i will repost the answer. It seems your eyes are as selective as your mind.

LOL! First of all Islam does not teach to follow the rulings of the kafre. And i dont know if you recall a verse from hundreds of years prior to Mohamed. Have you ever heard, give unto Caeser what is Caesars? WOW! You are one of the worst apologists on the face of the planet! I am not sure who is worse, you or Nadir! No wonder you didn't show up for the last several debates!
What do you think these mean?

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."

Qur'an (18:26) - "[Allah] maketh none to share in his government."

Qur'an (19:64) - "And we do not descend but by the command of your Lord; to Him belongs whatever is before us and whatever is behind us and whatever is between these, and your Lord is not forgetful."
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osmama

No, you're very wrong and superficial and wasting of time (see also Luke 2:52: GOD forgave Jesus). Plus, you're now pretending that you don't know Arabic idioms and styles of speech.

1- The Holy Quran is clear about no one knows what the future holds.

2- Allah Almighty also Said that ONLY HE KNOWS WHAT'S IN THE HEARTS AND MINDS OF PEOPLE.

3- In Islam everyone is a Muslim by FITRAH (while their helpless and clueless children who can't think for themselves and decide for themselves). Every child is a Muslim in Islam.

4- The Prophet said (sacrasticly) that if you know which child will become a hostile infidel when he grows up, then go ahead and kill it. I Muhammad never and will never kill any child because I don't know who will become a Muslim and will be a hostile enemy to Allah Almighty.

5- There are even many many Hadiths about the Prophet saying that he doesn't even know what will HAPPEN TO HIM PERSONALLY IN THIS LIFE AND IN THE HEREAFTER!

You still don't get it, do you?

All baseless unsubstantiated speculation and conjecture! You havent proven any of these things that you claim are absolutes. And I have already refuted most of them!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osmama

Quote "You are a liar, becasue the Arabic text doesn't say "until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam;"

Well OSmama you better take it up with Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan (http://www.aalalbayt.org) ® All Rights Reserved

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=9&tAyahNo=5&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2

Go call up the Royal Al Al bayt Institute for islamic thought and tell them they are liars. LOL!

You are to easy! Way to easy. your worse at debating then writing your fallacious ridiculous blog! LOL!

Yeah I get it Osama! I got it a long time ago!

60:8 was revealed before the commands to subjugate or slaughter ALL non Muslims for all time! Just like what I said in my first statement! It still holds true!

Abu Ishaq said that he heard al-Bara' b 'Azib (Allah be pleased with him) say: The last complete sura revealed (in the Holy Qur'an) is Sura tauba (i e. al-Bara'at, ix.), and the last verse revealed is that pertaining to Kalala.
Sahih Muslim 11:3941

Thoroughly and easily refuted. Now tell me what i didn't answer and I will scroll up and repost the answer.
: "@ Osmama

Quote "You are a liar, becasue the Arabic text doesn't say "until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam;"

Well OSmama you better take it up with Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan (http://www.aalalbayt.org) ® All Rights Reserved

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=9&tAyahNo=5&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2

Go call up the Royal Al Al bayt Institute for islamic thought and tell them they are liars. LOL!"

RESPONSE:

Did I not tell you that you're bankrupt and desperate? You first lied and said that it was the HOLY QURAN that Said it. It turns out that the Holy Book didn't. It was a mere tafsir (interpretation) of one scholar, or a student or a student of a student of a scholar, as these TAFSIR VOLUMES were not written by one or two people. The same goes for the Sahih Hadith volumes by the way Yet, in the very same link (using the drop-down list of the "Tafsir" field) that you gave, mister, the other scholar said different things:

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=73&tSoraNo=9&tAyahNo=5&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2
"(Then, when the sacred months have passed) then after the day of immolation when the month of Muharram passes, (slay the idolaters) whose treaty is for fifty days (wherever ye find them) whether in the Sacred Precinct or outside it, during the sacred months or at any other time, (and take them (captive)) imprison them, (and besiege them) in their homes, (and prepare for them each ambush) on every road they tread for trade. (But if they repent) from idolatry and believe in Allah (and establish worship) and acknowledge the five daily prayers (and pay the poor-due) acknowledge the payment of the poor-due, (then leave their way free) if they wish to go to the House of Allah. (Lo! Allah is Forgiving) He forgives whoever repents, (Merciful) towards whosoever dies in a state of repentance."

I can do the same and use the Talmud as Tafsir against the Bible, especially on the verses that deal with slaughters (which they dno't even need tafsir).

I just want everyone to see the ridiculous approach in this. These people use large volumes of books to pick and choose silly quotes and opinions of mere writers against Islam. While I admit that they may have some validity in this approach, but when they use these opinions and wrtings and say that these are ABSOLUTE LAWS IN ISLAM, THEN THIS BECOMES VERY RIDICULOUS!

Search4Truth, can you honestly tell everyone here that you deep inside yourself truly believe that Islam Commands the killing of all captives? I mean really, what are you try to prove here??

It's a simple yes or no answer.

Regards,
Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

LOL! You can use the Talmud all you want when you debate a Jew. Feel free. I am not Jewish! LOL!

You may be a worse apologist then Nadir Ahmed! Whats even funnier is you think that being consistent is a ridiculous approach.

So now the two Jalalayns are mere writers? They are Some of Islams greatest scholars. I used your scholars. You are not a scholar, In fact many Muslims thik your a heretic. because you are so inconsistent and illogical. Just like you have been here. I never said that islam commands the killing of all captives. How many times do I have to say this. I agree with your tafsir. Like i have been saying from the beginning.

ISLAM COMMANDS THE SUBJUGATION OR SLAUGHTER OF ALL NON Muslims FOR ALL TIME.

And I proved it in many ways with multiple sources from YOUR Islamic doctrine! Your pathetic. You are suffering from cognitive dissonance! The Jalalayns Knew what they were taling about. Your just a modern day indoctrinated zealot who cannot grasp the totality of what Islam teaches. i know it hurts you to accept the truth Osanma. Im sorry that you are hurt, and confused. I am trying to reach you. God is. It is clear for all that are capable of objective reasoning, critical thinking, and intellectual integrity to see. You are having difficulty accepting reality. It's what YOUR scholars and Prophet and Allah say! Accept it. you are lying to yourself!

YES I BELIEVE IT OSAMA! BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT ISLAM TEACHES!
Search 4 Truth said...: @ Osama

Sorry but i will trust your early scholars who were not trying to reinvent Islam to deceive themselves or the kafres !!

http://www.altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=74&tSoraNo=9&tAyahNo=5&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0&LanguageId=2

* تفسير Tafsir al-Jalalayn
{ فَإِذَا ٱنسَلَخَ ٱلأَشْهُرُ ٱلْحُرُمُ فَٱقْتُلُواْ ٱلْمُشْرِكِينَ حَيْثُ وَجَدتُّمُوهُمْ وَخُذُوهُمْ وَٱحْصُرُوهُمْ وَٱقْعُدُواْ لَهُمْ كُلَّ مَرْصَدٍ فَإِن تَابُواْ وَأَقَامُواْ ٱلصَّلَٰوةَ وَءَاتَوُاْ ٱلزَّكَٰوةَ فَخَلُّواْ سَبِيلَهُمْ إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ }

Then, when the sacred months have passed — that is, [at] the end of the period of deferment — slay the idolaters wherever you find them, be it during a lawful [period] or a sacred [one], and take them, captive, and confine them, to castles and forts, until they have no choice except [being put to] death or [acceptance of] Islam; and lie in wait for them at every place of ambush, [at every] route that they use (kulla, ‘every', is in the accusative because a [preceding] genitive-taking preposition has been removed). But if they repent, of unbelief, and establish prayer and pay the alms, then leave their way free, and do not interfere with them. God is Forgiving, Merciful, to those who repent.

Tafsir al-Jalalayn, trans. Feras Hamza
© 2012 Royal Aal al-Bayt Institute for Islamic Thought, Amman, Jordan (http://www.aalalbayt.org) ® All Rights Reserved

Read it and weep Osama!

Muslim (19:4294) - "When the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him... He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war... When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them.

Accept Islam, Be subjugated and be extorted from, live in an apartheid like status. or be murdered.

Now admit I was correct from the beginning. Or live a lie. You choose!

My Response to his last posts:

I am not trying to reinvent Islam. It is clear that it is you who is lying and fabricating lies on Islam. The quotes that you provided don't support your hateful, bigotted and desperate position. You're no more than a bankrupted criminal who has nothing but hate and lies to spread against Islam. Muslims must always revert back to:

1- Peace.
2- Justice.
3- Passing the Love of Allah to mankind.
4- Mercy

When dealing with people. Hostile times and wars have their Laws. I never disputed that. But as I've shown above, Islam Commands the Muslims to go back to the beautiful roots that I just mentioned with all people. If the disbelievers are not hostile, then we are to be kind and just with them. And even when we're in hostile times with a community or a group of people, we are still forbidden from mistreating and dealing unjustly with any of their countrymen that we may meet, or they live among us and under our rule.

You held for dear life over a Hadith of the Prophet commanding the Muslims to not stop the battle because some of the disbelievers' women and children were caught in the middle of it. You used this Hadith, and only this Hadith, to "prove" your phony lie about Islam commanding the killing of innocent people. I, again, want everyone to see how this desperate phony here proved that he is bankrupt. Because he didn't have anything to show from the Holy Quran and Hadiths, he used this incident and held on to it for dear life. All a while, his Bible has 10s of verses that command the slaughter of even suckling babies! Certainly, his desperation only shows and clearly and indisputably proves that Islam, indeed, doesn't command the Muslims to slaughter innocent people. On the contrary, as I've proven above with the example of Khalid and others, Islam clearly prohibits it, and the Prophet clearly commanded the Muslims against it.

Here are more proofs for you regarding the winners of Paradise from humans being Kings, and regarding Heaven being Physical:

1- Even in your scriptures, you were taught that GOD Almighty CREATED MAN FROM WHAT? FROM HIS IMAGE, OR BY HIS IMAGE! You have to understand that the spiritual beings can only DREAM about getting into our Physical Forms. This is why Allah Almighty in Islam had all of the Beings of the Universe bow down to Adam. All of them came down under the feet of the Believers.

2- So now, when GOD Almighty is called KING OF KINGS, then why should it come as a surprise to you that the human winners of Paradise will be KINGS in Paradise?

This is on my to-do list of articles. You listen too much to the silly haters of Islam who use the 72 virgins point and mock Islam with it. They are dumb, deaf and blind who understand not. They're also pornified whores who are doomed to Hell anyway.

CORRECTION:

"The least level is 5 times the size of earth....."

READS AS

The least level, FOR EVERY BELIEVER, is 5 times the size of earth.

More on this life being a preview to the Hereafter:

(This might sound racist or biased, but I don't care. I state the Truth as is!)

1- On the Day of Resurrection, according to our Islamic Sources, the Believers will resurrect as: Very bright White, having a Heavenly smell or perfume as their odor, and very very beautiful in their appearances. THIS OF IT AS THE ELVES IN THE LORD OF THE RINGS MOVIE. By the way, the ONE-EYED SARUN BEING SATAN was taken also from Islamic sources. As you know, the anti-Christ will be ONE-EYED. He will also command the sky to rain whenever he wishes. The US today can do that. And the US' symbol on its currency is the ONE-EYE.

2- The disbelievers will be resurrected as blind, darkened, smelling very bad, looking very ugly and displeasing to the eye.

3- Both the Believers and disbelievers will be seperated into two groups. They won't be mixed together while Judgement is happening.

4- The Believers will end up in Heaven and the disbelievers will end up in Hell.

My personally, seeing how GORGEOUS SOME PEOPLE (females and also males) CAN LOOK, in general, makes me believe that this is very very quite plausible in the Hereafter. Now regardless of your race, and the color of your eyes, hair and skin here on earth, your looks here don't make you ANY BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE. Allah Almighty Said in the Holy Quran that everything He gave man here on earth is a TRIAL FOR HIM/HER. So whether you're rich or poor, male or female, gorgous or not, it doesn't elate your or put you down in anyway. But seeing how things were created here on earth, I don't see how the Islamic claims about the Hereafter are not plausible.

I will write a DETAILED article on this, with tons of quotations to support every single point I mentioned on this thread for this topic, insha'Allah. I already have all of the quotes. I am just researching further to find more.

"Well, we already know you're a racist (specifically against Jews you blame for the evils Muslims do) and bigoted against Christians (blaming the ills of the west with Christianity, and ascribing false teachings) so this disclaimer is unnecessary."

RESPONSE:

No offense intended here, but either you missed my many explanations about this, or you're a liar for fabricating lies on me.

1- I don't hate Christians. But the SAME Christians who used to be sexually open, sexually sinning, and alcoholic are the same people who change 180 degrees when they embrace Islam. Christianity breeds filth in the society because it is a weak and corrupt and vague and doubtful religion, according to its own followers. So even if the book says do X, or don't do Y, you wouldn't do it or care about it because deep inside your gut you know it's a man-made corrupt book.

2- As to Jews, I made it clear that I am against the zionists, not the ordinary Jews. Although, it's hard to differentiate the two in many times. I mean imagine an assasine who is a medical doctor. That is something quite amazing.

Osama Abdallah
www.answering-christianity.com

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Where was the promised Holy Spirit in the disciples' apostatizing of each other??

The Romans had to fake fake his crucifixion due to Passover issues: [1]

Quran's STUNNING Divine Miracles: [1]

Allah Almighty also promised in several Divine Prophecies that He will show the Glorious Quran's Miracles to mankind. For example:

1- The root letters for "message" and all of its derivatives occur 513 times throughout the Glorious Quran. Yet, the Prophets' and Messengers' actual names (Muhammad, Moses, Noah, Abraham, Lot etc....) were also all mentioned 513 times in the Glorious Quran. See detailed listing here.

Coincidence? See 1,000s of examples! [1]. (zip file).

Quran's Stunning Numerical & Scientific Miracles.

Stunning Prophecies [2] [3]

2- Allah Almighty said that Prophet Noah lived for 950 years. Yet, all Praise and Glory are due to Allah Almighty Alone, the entire Noble Surah (chapter Noah) is exactly written in 950 Letters. You can thoroughly see the accurate count in the scanned images.

3- Allah Almighty in the Glorious Quran said that earth is:

       -  Spherical: "egg-shaped" [1].
       - Is rotating around itself.
       - Is moving in space in curvy orbits [2].
       - Is traveling through the constantly expanding universe [3].

"When the sky disintegrates, and turns rose colored like paint (وردة كالدهان)." (The Noble Quran, 55:37) [2] [3]

As we also see from the picture, Noble Verse 55:37 is a Divine Promise (Allah promised to show mankind) that mankind will actually see this come to pass one day. NASA and other space agencies, by Allah Almighty's Will, have certainly fulfilled this Prophecy, because a natural rose wouldn't form when a "Heaven" or a Solar System or even an entire galaxy and its
trillions of solar systems all blow up (explode). It is rather the look of it, and this is exactly what NASA confirms.

Coincidence? See 1,000s of examples [1].Quran's Stunning Numerical & Scientific Miracles.

Islam also thoroughly rejects as man-made lies the Trinity and Crucifixion [2]. Jesus was also thoroughly called slave of GOD [1] in both the OT and NT.

Quran: All Bibles are mostly of corrupt [1] قول (Quran 10:94 and 10s others discussed). See also the 39+ members of trinity. Jesus called every believer a Muslim in Luke 6:40.

John 5:30 "I cannot do anything on my own." (i.e., Jesus could not perform a single Miracle without GOD sending it down to him first!). I can not perform a single Miracle on my own!! I am totally POWERLESS without Allah Almighty!

John 5:31 "if I (Jesus) bear witness of myself, then I would be a liar!"

GOD didn't talk this way when He spoke to Moses. GOD's testimony alone is always sufficient! Jesus also bowed his face down to the ground, like we Muslims (Isaiah 56:5: Muslim is the future believers' name, and sons and daughters of GOD titles will be "no more"; ; Jesus called every believer a Muslim in Luke 6:40) Muslims do everyday, and prayed to GOD Almighty.